Amy, your comment is the most thoughtful of any that I have ever received on any blog. Thank you.
(I'm not sure what you mean by "delineate and break them down" into sub groups, but perhaps you can explain what you mean. Is this a reference to deaf students who attend BHS schools? I am very familiar with this population of students and their families.)
Amy, you seek "positive energy," correct? That's a good place to start. From my perspective, I see a lot of nicey-nicey, touchy-feely behavior on our board, a lot of self-congratulation. Most decisions are 7-0. Is this truly the best way to operate? Unanimity of thought does not beget truly creative and innovative solutions to the complex problems.
I think positive OUTCOMES are more important than positive energy. How do we get there?
I think schools are losing out to "group-think" on many school boards.
We don't need diversity for the sake of diversity. But group-think begets no opposing views to debate at all! That's not best for our students.
Debate and open discussion can benefit our schools, in that same way.
I bring diversity of thought to the board table, and I represent the voices of many who are not represented by the board majority. I will challenge my board colleagues to bring more preparation to the board table. Even if my ideas are shut down, Trustees will debate concepts in public. In that way, ideas can be fully vetted, publicly and thoroughly.

Jenny, your habit of referring to "K-12 and special needs students" as two separate groups is both inaccurate and patronizing. The overwhelming majority of students receiving special education services in the district are K-12 students. Yes, some students with special needs come to us before kindergarten. So do many general education preschoolers. Some students continue to receive special education services in post-secondary programs. The bottom line is that all of these children and young adult are students and are equally deserving of a comprehensive education.

Jenny, while I don't often agree with your positions, I respect them. I remember distinctly you posted a response to someone’s article suggesting we sell the farm, I am pretty sure it was in response to something Brandon wrote. I remember it because I replied to what you posted. But if I have that wrong, or you have changed your position, and I have misrepresented you position on this topic, I apologize. As you state above, in the very posting we are discussing, you are “not pro union”. By implication you must be anti-union, what else can anyone draw from your statement. I am “kind-of union” really doesn’t seem to be a choice does it? Lastly, you make it sound like some spaceship landed and brainwashed me while I wasn't watching. Trust me, I have not been manipulated. Not by little green men from Mars, OBU or 20/20. My positions have been pretty consistent. I have lived in this district since I was born in 1964 I have seen pretty much all there is to see here. I will not be manipulated by you, OBU, or any little green men from Mars.

R Gibson: Why must someone who is not pro-union necessarily be considered anti-union. How about a position that say that I respect and support the union to some degree, but in particular areas I think the union has gone too far. For example, with respect to health and retirement benefits, one could argue that the unions have advocated a benefit structure that is fiscally unsustainable. Maybe the union is a good voice for delineating the difficulties of measuring teachers for merit pay, yet at the same time, one might conclude that overall, merit pay needs to be introduced in some fashion or manner. Can't someone say that I'm not "pro union" but I understand that I will have to work with the union where we agree and challenge them were we disagree. Are you anti-union simply because you don't agree with the union 100% of the time?

R. Gibson: Regarding the Farm, I completely agree with you. Jenny strongly suggested in her blog titled "Two Small High Schools or one Big Farm" that she favored selling at least a significant part of the farm. You'll find a similar suggestion that the Farm is excess property in her blog "May 8 Election is a Dirty Trick". In her blog titled "Providing Oversight for Taxpayers" she didn't mince words when she stated "Do we really need a Farm. And a Nature Center?" She then went on to say that we aren't funded "per head of cattle". See her November 2nd blog too where she suggested we should consider selling the farm... and there's more, I won't bore you with it.

Sorry Jenny, as much as I may agree with you on some issues, trying to suggest that you aren't strongly looking at selling the farm strikes me as rather incredible in light of your previous statements.

http://bloomfield-mi.patch.com/blog_posts/two-small-high-schools-or-one-big-farm

http://bloomfield-mi.patch.com/blog_posts/cash-rich-school-district-should-not-dump-assets

http://bloomfield-mi.patch.com/blog_posts/providing-oversight-for-taxpayers

http://bloomfield-mi.patch.com/blog_posts/may-8-election-is-a-dirty-trick

http://bloomfield-mi.patch.com/blog_posts/education-dollars-for-education-makes-sense-to-me

Jenny,
Do you really not remember saying these things???

Well it has been a while Jenny, but I found what I wanted to find. In January you posted this article.

http://bloomfield-mi.patch.com/blog_posts/two-small-high-schools-or-one-big-farm

You said:

"The farm property is on the extreme northeast corner of the district, and can easily be accessed from I-75 at the Adams Road interchange. What a fantastic spot for a gas station and a Subway. Perhaps some savvy local developer will offer the BHSD a few million dollars for just part of it!

Has anyone considered the value of developing the portion of the property that is adjacent to I-75? A Tim Horton's would be a virtual gold-mine. Bloomfield Township would benefit from commercial property taxes. A win-win!"

Sounds to me like you think we should sell the farm.

Ms. Robovitsky,
In these posts Ms. Greenwell increasingly has shown not only an unwillingness to communicate with the community (other than her supporters) but a strange willingness to insult them, particularly parents, telling them they aren't interested in education (I don't know Mr. Gibson but his posts are unusually clear and forthright and nuanced and don't suggest a person easily "manipulated" at all -- there seems a good example of how she might respond to a parent with a real concern).. She has also shown only an interest in condemning past and current board practices. Indeed, she and her supporters seem to want to hunt for any possible piece of info that could be turned against the board or the District. That's called obstructionism, pure and simple; it has very little to do with a willingness to "speak up," etc. People need to be able to speak up but they also need to be able to interpret information fairly and quickly; right now -- financial information. Nothing in her posts or her cv suggests that capacity.

Ms Robovitsky, I agree with many of the things you have said here. As a life long resident of the township, I too would like to see my board more responsive to the community. I have 2 young kids in the district right now and have been impacted directly by many of the decisions that the prior administration and current administration have made. Unfortunately, in many cases, these are extremely complicated decisions that may require expert level experience in order to know what the right decision to make is. When we have had members that have extensive knowledge on specific topics, in particular, facilities, the community has not seen fit to be able to retain them. The board is being asked to make extremely difficult decisions, on topics where they have very little or no background, thus relying heavily on the administrations recommendations and guidance. While I personally believe that Dr. Glass is doing everything he can to correct so real and deep divisions in our community not of his making. The board has been beaten up so badly for so long, in some cases, through no fault of their own; that is going to take time for the community to trust them again, and for them to be able to speak openly about topics they may not agree upon. If you take a look at this posting and others, look at some of the vitriol that people are painted with. Who would want to put themselves or their family through that. I wouldn’t, would you?

“S Sera” could not serve as a better example of the vitrol.

It’s not enough to point out disagreement. Instead, she spews “ incapable of representing”. Incapable, as lacking capacity or ability? Could this be more insulting?

She chooses inflammatory and degrading words, such as “obstinacy” and “immaturity”.

Accusing her of “reading comprehension issues”? Yeah... great way to have a dialogue.

Amy Cardin opens the door for a reasonable discussion of differences in style and philosophy. “R Gibson” shares some examples, and does so in a way that offers Jenny a chance to respond. Then along comes bitter ‘ole S Sera… slamming the door shut.

Mr. Reno,

I will not back down because you choose to speak for Mrs. Greenwell. This is my community and my family that her behavior has adversely impacted. As stated above by her,

“If anyone has any idea what might motivate the "haters" who have so much time to post incredibly nasty and bizarre comments...believe me, I don't!

In light of what she wrote I provided a clear answer, which included the fact that I do not hate her. Repeating for myself…

“I speak up because I disagree with the things that you espouse and the methods that you would use should you be elected. You have a right to your beliefs and to speaking your mind just as every other American does. The difference is that you have a desire to impose your beliefs through "rule". I find that unacceptable.”

And yes, I very much believe she is incapable of serving the best interests of the taxpayers and students. All I have had to do was to look at the things she has written and read the minutes of board meetings to get a clear picture of her incapability.

"S Sera", you needn't flex your defiant muscles... It is not a matter of "backing down"

It's a matter of being nice -- or at least civil.

Surely you are a sharp enough writer that you can pick apart Jenny's points without gratuitously insulting her?

And don't you think it's excessively dramatic to suggest that your family is being adversely impacted by having Jenny write a few blog entries?

Mr. Reno,

I answered the question Mrs. Greenwell asked in her blog. I will not present a veneer of a debate so that you can distract people from Mrs. Greenwell. There is nothing to debate. Several other commentators as well as myself have pointed out the plentitude of Mrs. Greenwell’s own postings which serve as rebuttal to her own statements.

Mr. Barr,
I am concerned that you see Ms. Greenwell as opposed to any building in the District's future. That opposition would be a bit tricky, of course, because the District will begin work on the renovated high soon. She has celebrated the end of the "war" (her term) here and was running, she said, to help with the renovation of the new school. If someone was to read one of her staunchest supporters as saying "we do not want to build" the voting public might get a bit confused.

Don't ya just love people like neal who rail against intimidation and bullying...and then he posts a list of people a la McCarthy "style". If you are a candidate better run the other way as an endorsement from neal is the kiss of death.

Look in the mirror and read your own posts. They are filled with mean, vile comments to members of this community...your community. You keep telling people to look at the posts of others, I did, I looked at yours and they are terrible, mean things you say. You do hate people it comes through over and over again in your words and postings.

Mr. Barr ( I am not your patient that I know of -- you are certainly entitled to be proud of your medical degree/career but I am under no obligation of civility to refer to it -- if a medical issue comes up I will be happy to acknowledge your degree -- I try to afford you the same address I do every poster),

You say above "We do not want to build instead of hiring a top teacher." The "we" suggests you and Ms. Greenwell given the context. Given your vitriolic opposition to the bond ("anyone who votes for the bond is committing a crime against children" -- you did write that unless like other posts from 2020 it has been removed) and Ms. Greenwell's opposition to the bond it is reasonable to at least consider that one reason Ms. Greenwell is running is to continue that opposition. You suggest as much in your words about building.

Dr. Barr, I believe Mr. Aisner has made it clear that free speech will not be limited, though civility is encouraged. Jenny Greenwell has made the Patch her own personal soapbox, as is her right. It is also the right for readers to reply as often as they wish. Freedom of speech must go both ways. Let's not forget that Jenny herself has encouraged the robust conversations. She has condemned apathy.

Dr. Barr, as offended as you are by the words and tone of some other posters, I believe others have taken issue with your comments as well.

Jenny Greenwell also posted that the editor should muzzle my posts. This is good, if they weren't effective no one would care. The Barr/Greenwell group bullied the community for years. They were soundly repudiated this spring because people pushed back against them. This needs to persist until the Greenwell candidacy is rejected again. Our schools are too important. Despite the comments by the Greenwell people it's not about personalities--it's about our schools and our kids.

A good example of 2020 communication:

Ms. Cardin --"But I feel it's whats IN those days that makes the difference. Our kids get 180+ days of the highest quality education."

LInda P -- "Amy, why not quality and quantity?"

Mrs. Cardin,

I couldn't agree more. This is true of all things in life. It isn't the quantity of something that is important, but the quality of what we get whether it is physical quality or informational quality.

The rub is that to know these things about our schools would require either having a student/s in the schools and/or involvement of some form. Your children have moved on, but you haven't ceased being in the buildings so you know what is actually happening. You see not only what is required of the students, teachers, administrators and board members, but you see their "performance". You sharing what you see is so integral for those who do not have current students because you can compare it with what was required of your children as well as balance it with societal requirements. I am also thinking of Ms. Elizabeth at this moment because she has shared not only that she is contributing to various district committees, but what she witnesses through being a parent of a currently enrolled high schooler.

Seeing both sides of the coin is exceedingly important to maintaining balance and the development of positive changes.

Thank you for sharing not only your thoughts and experiences, but your positivity.

Linda raises some very good points in her post. Our friends and family in other countries are fairly amazed at our shorter school year. I wouldn't be surprised if that's a carry over from when we were much more of an agricultural society.

To go to a longer school year we would have to deal with a lot of issues. We would need to let the people in Lansing who have diverted money from education that it's short sighted and that they'll lose elections if they keep doing it. I wouldn't be surprised to see challenges from the tourism lobby which was able to require school to start after Labor Day.

I do think Linda is spot on regarding the examples of other nations. In thinking about it I wonder why none of the top private schools like Roeper, Det Country Day, and Cranbrook don't do longer terms. This isn't a dig at them, I just wonder why they haven't seen it as a good choice.

Linda and I have very different views about Ms. Greenwell and there's no upside to discussing that. I don't recollect her raising the length of the school year in any blogs but I could be mistaken. Bear in mind we don't need to elect Jenny to carry out good ideas that Linda has about education.

No, you don't need Jenny specifically. But you need someone who is an independent thinker. Somebody willing to move beyond groupthink... be willing to debate... and yes, even willing to disagree.

And some schools do have a longer year. IA comes to mind.

Linda and Neal,
Here is a link to an interesting article regarding number of school days around the world.

http://www.centerforpubliceducation.org/Main-Menu/Organizing-a-school/Time-in-school-How-does-the-US-compare

Many countries require more days in school but with a similar amount of hours of instruction. Interestingly, the highest performing schools are in Finland where they go to school for about 190 days but only 4-7 hours per day. They also give less homework and generally do not have additional lessons outside of school. These things are complicated. I don't think it is the number of days that makes the difference. I believe our government ties the hands of our teachers with rigid curriculum and very little freedom. The constant assessments cause teachers to have to teach to the test which may be beneficial to our status in the world but not to the students. I can tell you that our administrators and teachers are amazing. They are constantly looking for ways to improve student learning while under these rigid guidelines. This is where parents have an advantage in these conversations. We are aware of the daily efforts of our teachers and administrators to provide the best education that they can.

Our summers are important. Remember, these are children. There is some living to do on the way to preparing for their futures as adults. The school year is intense. They go to school for seven hours per day and have (depending on their age) 1-3 hours of homework. Add sports, music instruction, tutoring, religious education and other extracurricular activities and that leaves very little extra time. Often, we are unable to even eat together as a family because of such busy schedules. Our summer break gives us time to recharge and reconnect with our kids after the long busy school year. I would miss it terribly and Michigan as a whole would suffer a great loss from tourism revenue.

Kat1324,

Thank you for the link. Interesting reading. I am also finding the "OECD's Education at a Glance 2011" article interesting.(link in blue box) This is a topic that came up the last time that length of school years was brought up in this forum.

This topic is complicated which is why it is important not paint broad strokes of failure based on standardized test scores.

Pat, thanks for your thoughtful comments. I am concerned about our elementary students and possible crowded conditions in our 4 operating elementary buildings. A representative of the CM for the high school has stated (in a study session) that construction costs are 2-3% over budget at this time. Corrections can be made. Trustees will need to keep an eye on that.

Ms. Greenwell,
I would like to hear an explanation regarding your comments about the farm. This was a very firm denial of statements that you had made.
Here are your words:

"I want to sell the farm?
I want to eliminate the union?
I have never made either statement, in public or private, in writing or verbally.
Neither statement is true. Why did you say them?
Have you been manipulated? I think you need to consider that possibility".

Jon has kindly posted the links above. What is your reasoning for the denial? It is important to me that a school board trustee be honest and trustworthy. Please explain.

If you weren't there or didn't watch last night I strongly recommend taking a look when a replay is made available (probably today).

Can someone with a little more knowledge than I post a link to the Candidates Forum video? Would like to view it. Much appreciated.

http://bhstv.bloomfield.org/category/bhstv-all